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Single Idea 20845

[filed under theme 22. Metaethics / C. The Good / 3. Pleasure / c. Value of pleasure ]

Full Idea

Chrysippus (in his On Pleasure) denies even of pleasure that it is a good; for there are also shameful pleasures, and nothing shameful is good.

Gist of Idea

There are shameful pleasures, and nothing shameful is good, so pleasure is not a good

Source

report of Chrysippus (fragments/reports [c.240 BCE]) by Diogenes Laertius - Lives of Eminent Philosophers 07.103

Book Ref

'The Stoics Reader', ed/tr. Inwood,B/Gerson,L.P. [Hackett 2008], p.117

A Reaction

Socrates seems to have started this line of the thought, to argue that pleasure is not The Good. Stoics are more puritanical. Nothing counts as good if it is capable of being bad. Thus good pleasures are not good, which sounds odd.

Related Ideas

Idea 392 Neither intellect nor pleasure are the good, because they are not perfect and self-sufficient [Plato]

Idea 2070 Even people who think pleasure is the good admit that there are bad pleasures [Plato]

The 26 ideas with the same theme [how important is pleasure in life?]:

8142 The wise prefer good to pleasure; the foolish are drawn to pleasure by desire [Anon (Upan)]
240 It would be strange if the gods rewarded those who experienced the most pleasure in life [Plato]
157 Most pleasure is release from pain, and is therefore not worthwhile [Plato]
371 Reason, memory, truth and wisdom are far better than pleasure, for those who can attain them [Plato]
373 Pleasure is certainly very pleasant, but it doesn't follow that all pleasures are good [Plato]
376 Would you prefer a life of pleasure without reason, or one of reason without pleasure? [Plato]
379 The good must be sufficient and perfect, and neither intellect nor pleasure are that [Plato]
382 It is unlikely that the gods feel either pleasure or pain [Plato]
197 Some pleasures are not good, and some pains are not evil [Plato]
200 People tend only to disapprove of pleasure if it leads to pain, or prevents future pleasure [Plato]
2134 Philosophers are concerned with totally non-physical pleasures [Plato]
5259 If we criticise bodily pleasures as licentious and bad, why do we consider their opposite, pain, to be bad? [Aristotle]
96 Nobody would choose the mentality of a child, even if they had the greatest childish pleasures [Aristotle]
97 There are many things we would want even if they brought no pleasure [Aristotle]
98 It is right to pursue pleasure, because it enhances life, and life is a thing to choose [Aristotle]
99 If happiness were mere amusement it wouldn't be worth a lifetime's effort [Aristotle]
14056 We only need pleasure when we have the pain of desire [Epicurus]
508 Only accept beneficial pleasures [Democritus (attr)]
20845 There are shameful pleasures, and nothing shameful is good, so pleasure is not a good [Chrysippus, by Diog. Laertius]
20840 Stoics say pleasure is at most a byproduct of finding what is suitable for us [Stoic school, by Diog. Laertius]
3071 Justice has no virtue opposed to it, but pleasure has temperance opposed to it [Aurelius]
22269 We must fight fiercely to hang on to the few pleasures which survive into old age [Montaigne]
8104 What will you think of pleasures when you no longer enjoy them? [Joubert]
21466 Pleasure is weaker, and pain stronger, than we expect [Schopenhauer]
5905 We clearly value good character or understanding, as well as pleasure [Ross]
5929 No one thinks it doesn't matter whether pleasure is virtuously or viciously acquired [Ross]